Organic or Steroids – What does your church sell?

Usher: Hey Deak, brilliant post here – couldn’t help but tout it! Since we had such a good conversation because of it:

http://kingdomgrace.wordpress.com/2008/12/03/disciples-or-converts/

and Mark’s post shows it affected him with a slight twist (of lemon) hehe

http://mark-bymaswell.blogspot.com/2008/12/would-you-like-some-cracked-pepper-sir.html

Conversation that ensued after reading these:

Usher: Hey Deak, I’m not sure I take issue or not regarding the comment on “birds and imprinting”, but no bother.  I just wanted to bring out the point of how foreign “organic” mindsets are in today’s human western culture.  Is it any wonder that the church is so much a reflection of the supermarket?

 

Deacon: Go on, I’m listening.

 

Usher: There’s no place for “ugly carrots” in the produce section of today’s markets.  God forbid an ugly apple, pear, banana, mango, off color head of broccoli or anything else for that matter.  The first inclination to choose is that which is pretty and uniform and without blemish.  Taste, longevity and danger are all secondary.

 

Deacon: What brought all this on?

 

Usher: Most likely TV and the press I guess.  Ugly people don’t make it onto TV so the world strives to be thin and pretty and perfect, just like the stars and their air-brushed magazine covers.

 

Deacon: Your point?

 

Usher:  Churches have followed suit.  They’re full of “gifted” orators, professional musicians, accomplished businessmen on the committees and so on.  Entertainment and accommodation are the criteria the humans migrate to.  In the meantime, the “leaders” have to have ways to measure.  They migrate to numbers.  Numbers can be substantiated and boasted about.  The laypeople want pretty programs, shows and great music along with gifted sermonettes.  The pastors want accolades, money to add staff to share in the work and build job security as well as grow their careers.

 

Deacon: So where is discipleship in all that?

 

Usher: My  point exactly! 

 

Deacon: Can discipleship function in today’s church in the midst of all the other stuff?

 

Usher: Not if leaders are bent on measuring their success.  This is where the problem starts.  If you take away the programs (you lose the crowds).  Take away the great orators (you lose the crowds).  Take away the money (you lose the crowds and the buildings).  Take away the professional musicians (you lose the crowds).  Take away the money (you lose the career-oriented staff) and voila!  Now you haven’t the distractions, nor the expectations, nor the crowds. 

 

Deacon: So you’re saying that crowds = success?

 

Usher That’s kind of what it all boils down to.  Ask the televangelists.  Crowds equal numbers, numbers equals money, money equals success and thus, God must be in it.

 

Deacon: So if there are no crowds, then there is no money, how does the church grow?

 

Usher: Christ had only 12 disciples.  He didn’t say things to the crowds to attract them or their money, in fact the largest crowds he attracted, he fed.  And then he said tough things to the crowds and the crowds left and he went about his discipling.  Scriptures say he wasn’t a “special” or “beautiful” person.  Maybe this was because he knew if he came to earth a beautiful being, then we would all feel insecure because we are all imperfect when we compare ourselves to “beautiful” people.  (Even beautiful people have proven this is true.) He discipled imperfect people and the church survived all these years without “perfect” people.

 

Deacon: So this is why the church seems to be portraying itself to be the “perfect” or “blessed” one?

 

Usher: A discipler works with the ground that he’s on, with the people God gives him.  He sees everyone a precious gift from God.  He is challenged to bring out God in these people no matter their lot in life.  Every member has a place in God’s kingdom, but not in man’s.  Today’s church seems to “market to the people who want to be like us” creating sects and divisions and exclusivity.  Thus the 35,000 denominations.  In an environment like this, everyone strives to become like the leader, the perfect carrot if you will.  Except they don’t know he is just like them if you take away the steroids, the pesticides, the pretty packaging and the artificial coloring.  In essence, the church normalizes and cripples the body and discipleship empowers the body.  If pastors didn’t care about credit and measurement and they truly wanted the kingdom to prevail, they’d do all within their ability to empower the kingdom.  This would eliminate the focus of one pastor to many and bring on the every man a minister.  The church would then become the all-powerful organic vehicle it was in the first century.  A true discipler as mentioned in comments above operates under the radar.  They seek no glory.  They thrive on seeing the kingdom multiply itself.  They rarely take titles, they urge their disciples to follow in their footsteps and become disciplers. They are often unrecognizable in a crowd.

Church, State & Wall Street

Usher: Deak, What do politicians, fund managers & megachurch pastors have in common?

Deacon: I don’t know Usher, but I’m sure you’re going to enlighten me…

Usher: No matter what they promise, you’ll never see your taxes, tithe or 401K money again!

The Brand of “Jesus”

Usher: Hey Deak, don’t you pity the poor souls who buy into the rhetoric of the mainstream church? Especially the young ones who call themselves “church planters” who work for big old institutions.

Deacon: Kinda. But not really.  They’re too young to know any better and they don’t seem to want to do the due diligence it takes to find out that the organization they’re in is simply marketing the institution, not making disciples. 

Usher: It really is just like America and the whole American Dream.  It’s just that they’re using the brand of “Jesus” instead of Coca Cola or Pepsi or Marlboro.

Deacon: And interestingly enough, they see no wrong in it.  They seem to think that “marketing” is making disciples.  But in reality, it’s so different. 

Usher: They’re no better than “Carney Barkers” selling tickets to see the 2-headed, 5-arm lady.  Except in this case, the 2-headed lady is Benny Hinn, Richard Roberts, Kenny Copeland, Rick Warren…

Deacon: Usher, stop. You’re overdoing it man!  You gotta stop blasting the televangelists!  They need to eat their caviar, take their vacations and put fuel in their private jets too!

The Institution Must Be Challenged! It’s Been Hijacked!

Usher: Deak, it’d be so much easier if everyone wasn’t so quick to endorse the institution right out of the gate.  It’s apparent that the reputation and validity of the institution has to be challenged.

Deacon: At what cost, Usher? 

Usher: At any cost.  Man was the one that came up with the goofy model back in Constantine’s time and it’s foundation is wide and vast.  How is it that it hasn’t been questioned vehemently until today?

Deacon: Yet, the foundation is being shaken. By generations that seem to be more and more willing to speak out against it, due to the egregious acts against society the church has committed (Catholic church pedofiles and gambling priests, Televanglists, crooked Christian entertainers).

Usher: Don’t forget Deak, the only ones that are willing to speak up are those who have nothing to lose!

Deacon: You’ve got plenty of friends that fit into that category Usher.

Usher: That’s a little low…..

Televangelists’ School of Scandal

Usher: Deak, I put this up for you. 

Deacon: Oh so nice of you Usher.  What do you do for an encore?

Usher: Stay tuned….

 

Usher Responds to Comment on “Confessions of A Faithful Tither”

Iven Garland
ivengarland@yahoo.com | 207.154.59.124

I have a major problem with people who go against the church. Let your rent be due, lights b off, and no food in the fridge the church will be the first people u call. I’ve seen megq churches give cars ,houses, rebuild homes ,and lives. ” Touch not thy annointed and do the phophet no harm”.

From True Confessions of a Faithful Tither, Kandise Lucas, PhD, 2008/09/09 at 5:11 AM

Deacon: So what do you think about Iven’s comment Usher?

Usher: First of all, he should learn to use spell checker (and grammatical checker for that matter), second of all, a little good doesn’t cover up all the abuse, misuse and manipulation of the naive.  I wouldn’t put any of these hucksters in the category of annointed!

Deacon: So you’re saying that even if they do good – they should go?

Usher: The megachurch operates like a politician.  It’s mornings are spent lobbying for causes it will never fufill, it’s days spent enjoying the good life in an attempt to rub elbows with famous people and “Oh, by the way, give the crumbs to the food pantry”.  In the meantime, they live the life of Reilly flying around the country in private jets (provided by the church) and staying in 5 star hotels at the expense of those poor people who are impoverished because they are giving to these imposters.  When was the last time a politician kept their promise?  Have you ever seen the church come to your side and bail you out of a real problem?  People who read this, please stop by and tell us how you feel – and don’t forget to copy our friend Iven.

UPDATE: Richard sued by accountant for “cooking the books”?

More on “King Richard’s” perils:

TULSA — Three more lawsuits rocked scandal-stricken Oral Roberts University on Wednesday, including one claiming Richard and Lindsay Roberts ordered an accountant to “cook the books” to cover up their illegal use of university money for themselves.

Oral’s Boy Shown The Door – WITH PAY!!!!

Usher: Hey Deak, does it ever end?  Priests gamble away tens of thousands and get leave, counseling while they continue giving mass  and geta a load of this one; Ricard Roberts spends the people’s money in the name of God on a Mercedes and a Lexus and jet trips for his daughter’s graduation to the Bahamas and they give him a severance!  What can we do to get some of that? 

Deacon: Entitlement Usher, entitlement.  After all, it’s his daddy’s church, why shouldn’t he have access to all the funds. 

Usher: It’s a church Deak, it’s the people’s money.

Deacon: How do you get that Usher?  It’s God’s money and his “annointed” will “further the kingdom” with it.  After all, Creflo feels more comfortable ministering in a Rolls Royce toolin’ around Atlanta while Richard prefers a Mercedes or a Jaguar to be able to relate to the privileged in order to share the gospel with them.  If you don’t have all the bling, you can’t get them to give and to sing.  Kenny C, now he needs a jet airplane to minister the gosple at 30,000 feet on his way to the Fiji Islands.

Usher: And the questions of the people in regards to their unusual behavior have now become a witch hunt according to Richard (see caption below).

Ex-head of Oral Roberts Univ. to get severance

Televangelist resigns from post amid allegations of misspent school funds

updated 8:03 p.m. ET, Wed., Aug. 13, 2008

TULSA, Oklahoma – The former president of an Oklahoma university founded by televangelist Oral Roberts, who stepped down amid allegations he misspent school funds to live in luxury, was offered a severance package but officials would not divulge its terms.

Roberts’ son, televangelist Richard Roberts, resigned from Oral Roberts University in November.

He and his wife, Lindsay, were accused of dropping money on shopping sprees, home improvements and a stable of horses for their daughters at a time when ORU was more than $50 million in debt. Both have repeatedly denied wrongdoing.

In her 1983 memoir, “Ashes to Gold,” Richard Roberts’ first wife, Patti, documented the jet-set lifestyle: a blue Mercedes as a Christmas gift for Richard, a Jaguar for her, Italian suits and Palm Beach vacations.

“We lived like characters in a novel or a made-for-TV movie about the beautiful people and I reveled in it,” she wrote. “Having made a truce, albeit an uneasy one, with my conscience over the source of our wealth, I proceeded to enjoy its prerogatives with total abandon.”

One person who says she observed the Roberts’s profligate spending up-close is Suzanne Culpepper. After hearing news of the lawsuit, she decided to come forward to recount her time working as a nanny for the Robertses one summer in the late 1980s, when she was an ORU student. Fed up with hearing the Robertses complain about the university’s financial hardship at the time, she snooped around their walk-in closet one night while the couple was out and the kids were asleep. It was “bigger than the one-bedroom apartment I live in now,” says Culpepper. She counted 275 pairs of shoes for Lindsay, all arranged by color, three rows of dresses and “tons of jewelry.” On Richard’s side, there were 160 suits, 454 ties and 18 pairs of golf shoes.  (A university spokesman declined to respond to a request for comment on Culpepper’s description.) “I had a righteous anger to an injustice,” she says. “It is so sad that people have been misled, but the truth is coming out.” Until the Robertses get a chance to respond with their own version of events, they’re surely praying as fervently as ever.

updated 8:01 p.m. ET, Fri., Oct. 5, 2007

TULSA, Okla. – Twenty years ago, televangelist Oral Roberts said he was reading a spy novel when God appeared to him and told him to raise $8 million for Roberts’ university, or else he would be “called home.”

Now, his son, Oral Roberts University President Richard Roberts, says God is speaking again, telling him to deny lurid allegations in a lawsuit that threatens to engulf this 44-year-old Bible Belt college in scandal.

Richard Roberts is accused of illegal involvement in a local political campaign and lavish spending at donors’ expense, including numerous home remodeling projects, use of the university jet for his daughter’s senior trip to the Bahamas and a red Mercedes convertible and a Lexus SUV for his wife, Lindsay.

Richard Roberts, president of Oral Roberts University, said God told him “this lawsuit … is about intimidation, blackmail and extortion.”

Here’s Where Your Tithe Goes! 20/20 John Stossel

Usher: Hey Deak, someone else actually thinks like we do!!!!!! Deacon: Go Rusty Go Rusty Go!!!!!! Usher: He actually put 2 million dollars of his own money where his mouth is! Deacon: Too bad you don’t have more money and less mouth!   MinistryWatch featured on 20/20 with John Stossel: MinistryWatch.com was recently interviewed on ABC’s 20/20 with John Stossel regarding the lack of financial transparency among some televangelists. A transcript of the interview is available (pdf) »HERE.« Please also see our amplification of the story »HERE« and a personal note from Rusty Leonard »HERE«.